Poll: Do We Support Working Mothers Enough?
New Yahoo CEO Marissa Mayer's maternity leave plans have left some wondering whether women can have it all, or should even try.
New Yahoo CEO Marissa Mayer plans to take just a few weeks off after having her baby and to work through her leave, according to Fortune Magazine.
Mayer's announcement and the fact that she is the first person to become chief executive of a Fortune 500 company while pregnant has generated a lot of discussion about pregnancy options for working women, noted the New York Times.
Mayer's compensation package is estimated to be worth about $60 million, USA Today reported. Mayer will have all the help she feels she needs in terms of childcare, options most working mothers do not have.
The 1993 Family Medical Leave Act guarantees women 12 weeks of unpaid leave, according to BabyCenter.com. The website notes that act does not cover most smaller companies.
Most women who take leave use a combination of short-term disability, sick time and vacation to maintain some income after giving birth. Although, few would consider taking care of a newborn a vacation.
Many other countries offer far more time off, often paid. According to workingmother.com, the U.S. is one of a few countries that does not mandate paid leave for new mothers. Some of the other countries on the list are Swaziland and Papua New Guinea.
Earlier this month, Anne-Marie Slaughter wrote an article in the Atlantic "Why Women Still Can't Have It All."
"I still strongly believe that women can 'have it all,' " Slaughter wrote. "But not today, not with the way America's economy and society are currently structured."
Judy Rubin
6:19 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
No! When you have after school activities outside of school starting at 3:30 or 4PM on a week day! Also, why does Hebrew School have to start at 4:15? In NYC, the demand from, working parents was high enough that Hebrew School is combined with Sunday school --- only one day a week on Sundays!
Life outside of school is still-centered on an old-fashioned schedule -- stay-at-home mom and working dad! Get real! Either work places schedules need to adjust or after school sports, schools, etc.
Willie Wilmette
5:31 pm on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
All moms should get 18 years of paid leave for each child, 22 years if the child goes to college.
Sure many businesses would not hire women, but that would leave more opportunities for Willie.
Sure many say if you can not care for your own kids, you should not have them but kids happen along.
Shannon Harrell McCarthy
6:38 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Our own park district has very few classes for kids that are available for working moms. Anne-Marie Slaughter is correct! School and activities are based on a family model that is not as common as it used to be.
Jose
7:28 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
stop complaining and move on... My mom raised 14 kids with no help from anyone. she worked her butt off in a factory with no air to support us...so when i hear modern day women crying and complaining ??? They are spoil big time and they gotta it made compare to moms in the old days. Today' s moms ? would not last one day in my mom shoes.
stop crying and complaining.
Me
7:45 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
@Jose - It is painfully obvious that you are a troll. You need to practice being more subtle.
Laura Gottardi-Littell
8:43 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Jose, there's a difference between complaining and standing up for one's rights. Your mother shouldn't have had to work her butt off in a factory with no air and 14 kids with no help from anyone. Is that what you would want for your daughter? Are men asked to raise 14 kids by themselves while working under those conditions?
Lynda
12:53 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Jose, you obviously could not have done what your mother did and do you not know that times have changed? Perhaps you should get a bow and arrow and go hunt food on a daily basis for your family. Pretend there are no grocery stores! Get a life, man!
Phillip Szydelko
9:26 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Hose your mom is a great Lady, she took responsabity for her choices. not expecting others to do it for her. Im sure you have great respect for your mother and learned well from her. and me's children are going to grow up dealing with things they don't like by calling people bad names.
grandpa
8:42 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
The article is about a woman whose compensation is $60 million. I think she would be able to struggle by even if she needed to take off some unpaid time.
Regarding folks in the real world, although the question is poorly worded, having children IS a choice as is everything else in life. We, as a society, have been unrealistic in our expectation that somehow society should help support our private life choices.
Pull up your Dora big girl panties and deal with it cupcake.
Shawn
1:30 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Grandpa, your misogynistic mindframe is antiquated, and highlights how out of touch you truly are with the world around you.
How dare you condescend to these women by calling them names like "cupcake"?
Honestly, whenever you comment on this site you bolster the stereotype of the angry old curmudgeon.
Laura Gottardi-Littell
9:00 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Grandpa, our society pays lip service to the importance of parenting well, but through its actions shows that this is not truly a priority, and women bear the brunt of this. Have you ever given birth, cared night and day for newborns while holding down a job that is necessary for your family's survival, and/or your need to contribute your gifts and talents to the world? Didn't think so. Women who are juggling these real and important demands are not the "cupcakes" you insultingly describe them to be.
Jaimie Walnes
9:13 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
In the UK, mothers get 6 months statutory paid maternity leave and fathers get 2 weeks statutory paid paternity leave. The UK economy is in the same condition as the US. Other Western European countries have more generous maternity leave packages and their companies cope absolutely fine. (Don't talk about Greece).
The problem is one of US politics and the nation being right of center. The USA is meant to be a world leader, but when you look at the lack of a universal health system, maternity leave and the political system - the USA has a very long way to go to build a better society for everyone in it - not just the rich.
Bringin' Down Briarwood
10:55 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Thank you, Jaimie. I'm surprised it took this long for anyone to comment on the most basic foundation of motherhood - the first year.
The US standard of 6-8 weeks paid/unpaid (depending on the size of the company) is ridiculous!!!! It's one year in Canada!
I have mixed feelings about one year, but certainly there's a gap that these multi-billion dollar, cheap-*** corporations can fill and support. Or would that actually affect .01% of their bottom line?
LMJ
9:23 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
There are many people complaining that women don't make as much as men doing the same job now a days, supossedly. As this survey says, if you start adding on MORE benefits, women specific, then is it any wonder they do get paid less? It's tough now a days for everyone. I don't fault women for needing to go get jobs to help make essential ends meet, but fair or not, we are the baby machines and their are certain risks for an employer to hire a child bearing age woman. In this economy, you can't expect a employer to just suck it up.
That whole get a job to send your kids to daycare thing confuses me to no end, just as a side note. I really feel if you can swing it, though very tough, mom or dad should be at home raising their kids. They need YOUR values and training, not the babysitters. The heart break you feel leaving your kids at one of those places is put there for a reason. You and your child are connected that no one else should take.
Though I'm sure unpopular, this is just my opinion.
Jaimie Walnes
9:29 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
I'm a stay at home mom, but send my children to daycare in Winnetka 2 days a week because they love playing with all the other kids, going on field trips on the yellow school bus and I have found it really helps with social skills big time. I wouldn't want them there full time, but good daycare has so much to offer.
Dan Arenov
10:16 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Marissa Maher is a huge liberal. Did anyone ever think that Yahoo could go further to the left? they are the biggest liberal propaganda outfit out there. People don't realize that, but Yahoo does a great job in reporting positive things for the left and negative things for the right. Maher will continue this tradition.
Jaimie Walnes
10:26 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Dan is correct. However, in a right of center country, the left needs some help if the terrible income gap in the USA is ever going to be narrowed, rather than continuing to widen. I'm no 'Occupy Wall Street' because I don't think the US has the institutional structure or will to change. Things will remain the way they always have. Interesting that in the 'land of opportunity' social mobility is much harder than it is in Europe. I think Canada is a good model (and no I'm not Canadian).
Dan Arenov
10:52 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Jaime, you would never think this was a center-right country if you just watched ABC, NBC and CBS. Their 'journalists' are admittedly more than 80% liberals along with the producers, writers, etc..
These people do not feel like they are slanting the news to the left, because this falls in line with their core beliefs.
Many liberal journalists, when discussing media bias, say that it just so happens that the liberal worldview is "the truth".
They fail to accept the FACT that it might not be somebody else's 'truth'.
barry
11:46 am on Sunday, July 22, 2012
To Dan....two words: FOX NEWS.
Any objective and intelligent person associates Fox with the National Inquirer.
PTO, and school districts in general. park districts. Doctors offices schedules. Health club class schedules so many entities are geared to a stay at home parent or ....just NOT someone that is employed during the day.
Dan Arenov
12:30 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Barry, thanks for mentioning the National Enquirer.
For all the sensationalist news they put out, they broke the John Edwards affair story that ABC, NBC and CBS knew about for months but did not broadcast. Why? They wanted to protect their liberal glamour boy.
Face it. Unbiased journalism from the 'big three' is dead.
annie
12:04 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
If I made 60 million, when I was a working mother, yes, I could have had it all.
However, I had my kids before the Family Leave Act, came into play. I went to work exactly 6 weeks after I had both kids. Daycare costs a lot and in the end, its really a wash. You pay out most of your salary for someone else to watch the kids. I finally quit my job when the kids were 18 mos & 3 years old. Every time one of them had a fever while I was working, I had to leave work, go get them and try to be at the drs. office before 5pm. Of course, I never got a raise, since I was always leaving work. If they were sick, I couldn't take them to day care & therefore, could not go to work. In the end, we decided that it would be cheaper for me to stay home than go to work. I hardly think a pregnant woman who makes $60 mil a year is the right example. She is going to have: round the clock care for her kid, so yes she can take 3 weeks off, work from her home office, etc.
Local
12:05 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Hey Barry, first of all it's National Enquirer, not "Inquirer". Secondly the fact that you state "Any objective and intelligent person associates Fox with the National Inquirer", shows that you are neither. I can only imagine the non-partasian hacks at MSDNC are you're source for "news". Admittedly, they do have an unfair advantage, being the only network with a correspondent embedded securely in Obama's keester!
annie
12:05 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
For some families with the economy the way it is now, they must both work to survive. No, we do not support working women enough.
Jac Charlier
1:35 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
No, we do not do enough to support mothers or fathers, or families for that matter. This issue begins prior to the birth, of course. Starting with full, quality pre-natal care (which if a woman is working she must be able to attend to all the appointments that go with this critical part of her pregnancy) to delivery and the first days after birth (why can't the father be off of work too at this critical time to support the mother?) to the first few months and first year (unpaid leave means a cruel choice for some). If you have means, you are OK (maybe not where you want to be still) but if you are, like a growing number of American families, you do not.
Me
1:38 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Not to be sexist or anything but how about working dads? I happen to be a single father of two. Other than a paltry social security check, there is no support out there.
Jac Charlier
1:42 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
@Me - Yes, agreed, see my post that came in just before yours. We were thinking and typing the same thing! This is about supporting families in whatever configuration, although the impact on women is still the biggest piece of the pie of course.
Questioning
2:18 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Why should people with their own families or people without families have to support the choices of other people to have families?
Jac Charlier
4:23 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
@questioning. Thanks for the great comment.
Simply put, it's a matter of where you stand on a question that concerns the nature of our democracy. One of the most fundamental tensions in our great republic is between individual liberty (freedom) and collective action (E Pluribus Unum, We The People). This can be applied to many issues i.e. public unions, public pensions, healthcare, public education, etc...
In the case of our children and their caregivers (not limited to mothers but also inclusive of fathers), I strongly support collective action. Why? Our children are indeed our future. Their early years when they learn to care, love, develop self-confidence, "grow" their values, learn how to be a good neighbor and receive an education has tremendous importance for our future. Our society will only get a few years to develop our children into citizens and leaders. I believe in making that investment.
jillian
4:30 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
I fully agree with "Questioning." I worked for a corporation into my 30's and my husband and I carefully decided when we could afford to start a family. We never expected society or a business entity to pay for/subsidize our choices. I painfully walked away from a career after the birth of my second child, which had a life-altering impact on our lifestyle, so that I could care for my family. Even more painful is the reality of how difficult it has been to try and re-enter the workforce after taking time off. However, my husband has his own small business, and as an employer/entrepreneur, could never afford to subsidize the extended maternity leave that so many women seek. His company would be forced to hire only men if required to to cover those expenses and would be short "brain-power" to cover the work load of others gone on leave. Business owners make choices based on the bottom line, and families must make choices as they plan for their future. While pregnant and afterwards, I worked as though I wasn't, and I never expected my employer to cut me a special deal. We have had to grossly adjust our lifestyle with every choice we have made.
Margaret McCarthy
3:56 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Basically, working mothers want the benefits of having a job while asking others to shoulder the costs of having children. Fie on free-loaders. Someone has to care for children. Before having them, it behooves a woman to know who that someone will be and who will be providing the support for that care if she isn't willing or able to do both.
In my day, a woman married a man who was capable of supporting her children (and who bought insurance against his untimely death or disability) so she could stay home and raise them. When they were old enough, she returned to work for the extras and college, if that was necessary, but knew that she and/or the family would have to juggle the chores that she used to do as part of her role in the family.
Too many women want to have it all -- not possible. Either you raise your children or someone else does, and that person has to be paid. Most of us lived in smaller houses, had modest vacations, one car for many years, not many new clothes or meals out. That was the price paid for mothers at home to provide care and security for their children and help for aging family members.
Those of us who paid the price now have stable grown children and numerous, nice grandchildren. Well worth any sacrifice of things along the way.
LMJ
4:25 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
I agree, Margaret.
Jac Charlier
4:28 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
@Margaret. A great story you have to tell. Congrats to you and your still growing family.
I agree that entering into parenthood, for either a woman or man, is a huge decision, not to be taken lightly and in most cases I too hope that the parents have thought out as best they could knowing what they know at that time what the game plan will be for their future family. No easy task and no easy decision. Great points you make. Thanks.
LG
4:29 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Your comments ignore the reality that women, Luke men, train now for careers that require long hours. No one asks or expects men to choose between professional careers and having children...why should women be expected to "choose?" No one is talking about free-loading...we're talking about realizing that women need time to prepare for, and recover from child are and round-the-clock newborns, and societies that recognize women as full people worthy of respect and dignity (rather than"baby machines)" recognize that they should probably get at least a little paid family leave, as should the father. Also it makes sense as a society to think about how we schedule activities for kids and work life so working parents(male and female) aren't caught in the middle.
jillian
4:53 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
My husband & I SHARED the work load of caring for our young children when we were BOTH employed, and the choice of who left the workforce to stay home with the kids was eventually based on long-term income projections, a long-term budget/family plan, and the realization that it was up to US to decide how we would best live out life to meet our own personal expectations for the future for our family...We never expected anyone else to subsidize our personal choices. We know of many families where the husband has chosen to stay home, or where one (or both) have had to alter their place of employment to make himself/herself more accessible to the needs of the family. Employers are not endless sources of free funding, so no wonder women are discriminated against when they start to ask for special deals. People need to plan their future based on their means, and like the comment from Margaret McCarty, our family takes NO vacations, drives very old vehicles, has restricted technology and shops when necessary for items on sale. We are self-employed, self-insured, and have no pension benefits so we know we will be working until we can't, but we made our choices and are proud to acknowledge that we have never asked for society to subsidize them... not in good times or in bad.
RationalTht
7:33 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
@LG - men are really not given the OPTION of staying home and raising children. There are more stay at home dads now, especially during this economy, but even 5 to 10 years ago, it was REALLY rare and there was really no social support. There were / are lots of "Mommy and me" type activities, but not much for "daddy and me".
Jac Charlier
4:35 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
@LG Absolutely appropriate thread as part of this conversation. And on that note, coincidentally, I must finish my "D. Coke and pretzel break" and get back to my kids! Looking forward to reading more comments.
LG
4:35 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Excuse iPhone typing....meant to say "women need time to prepare for and recover from, and bond with infants." I son't think working mothers are looking for a hand-out from society at all. Hist reasonable conditions under which to do both their jobs. And a liittke respect. BYW, I think working fathers should have some flex-time and family leave too, because most of the fathers I know wish they could spend more time with their kids. And the kids them them to.
Abigail
5:04 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
I have several comments, so hold on . . .
First of all, could the writer of this article have chosen anyone more out-of-touch with reality than the CEO of Yahoo? Of course she's a lib who feels that she's owed everything and, by golly, working moms deserve to be financed by their employers for having children! It's owed to them!
Second, in an office setting there are always other employees who have to pick up the slack for the woman who has to give birth every year like clockwork, or the moms who have to take little Janie to the doctor or little Johnnie to a baseball game. Are these other employees ever compensated for the extra work they take on? NO, it's 'you run along and take care of your child and give the extra work to Abby to complete as you're leaving.'
(continued)
jillian
5:20 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
OMG... you have to be kidding :( Hard for me to understand this way of living. My fellow employees (and I) took the time when necessary knowing that we/they/I absolutely made up the time (missed work) later. FLEXIBILITY to live life, YES! Expecting another to carry your load, NO! Most of us try to help out in a time of need, but hopefully most of us don't EXPECT others to carry our load. I guess I have too much PRIDE and RESPECT for others.
Abigail
5:12 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Third, one of my former employers had a strict policy that moms who work from home cannot take care of their children at the same time. In other words, if you are working from home anytime during the week, your children have to be in daycare during that time because you are expected to be WORKING. What a concept! It also applied if you were caring for an elderly person in your home. Now, did individual managers with this company follow this policy to the letter? NO! Some of them actually looked the other way and allowed working moms to take care of their children while being paid to work. Whatever work that wasn't completed by the working moms was given to other employees to do.
One caveat if businesses are told to give working moms fully paid maternity leave at the employer's expense, less working moms will have jobs and fewer women of child-bearing years will be hired by corporations. Thus, making women like me--no longer of child bearing years--more appealing to employers.
We do more than enough for working moms. If they can't handle the pressure, maybe they shouldn't have children.
LG
5:35 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Oops should say "kids need their dadst also.."
LG
6:35 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Abigail, would you ever say to a man: "If you can't handle holding down a job and being the main caregiver for young children...maybe you should forget having a job, or forget about having children?" All the women I know are asking for is a society that respects them enough to allow them to use their Gid-given talents and brains AND be the good, loving, capable mothers they want to be without forcing them to choose. Men are not asked to make these heart-wrenching choices nearly as often as women are.
Abigail
7:17 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
LG, if they can handle the job and have a family at the same time--fine. But to expect full pay for 12 weeks off after having a baby, or mandated time off for new mothers just because other countries have it is a load of BS. Who takes up the slack at work? Why should an employer have to subsidize this? Maybe you haven't noticed that European countries with all these benefits are BROKE!!
These women feel they are owed something. I guess the tax breaks they get for having more children isn't enough. I guess the education for their children on the backs of the taxpayers isn't enough. We all know who pays for this. Where does it all end?
When my former employer laid off a group of us 3 years ago, not one working parent was laid off--it was all people who didn't have children at home. Someday I hope someone does a report on the statistics for that, because it sure seems to me that people with kids get special treatment--and it's time for that to stop.
LG
6:38 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Above should say "God-given" --excuse the iPhone typing again!
Jac Charlier
8:42 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Do we have any sense of shared sense of responsibility for one another in regards to this issue? If you believe no, then it is likely you will not be supportive of this topic. If you believe yes, then it is likely you will be supportive of this topic. These are generalizations and ranges exist in-between of course. So, having said that, can we see each other's point-of-view? Do our experiences alone dictate our position on this issue? Do we have the ability to change our opinion? This is the challenge of American today, possible division with little room to move. Let's see how this discussion continues to unfold.
LG
9:17 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Jac, I like your tone. It's important to be open.
Abigail, glad you think it's basically OK for women to have kids and work outside the home.
Fact: many women in the US MUST work to support their families. The cost of living has gone up tremendously since the 1950s and 60s. And many women feel they need to work to preserve their sanity, to use their God-given brains and gifts and contribute fully to the world. Women in US and elsewhere still do most of the laundry, cooking, childcare, shopping, and other household chores. So if they work outside the home, as many must and many choose to, they work a 2nd shift when they get home. Is that "special treatment?"
Once I asked a friend of ours, a science professor at a well-respected university, which was harder: teaching graduate students and running a laboratory, or taking care of his very young daughter? He said without a moment's hesitation, "Definitely taking care of my daughter."
If you've ever cared for a child, you know it can be exhausting and demanding as well as joyful. I think women need time to recover after giving birth (which can involve complications for both mother and baby) and to learn how to bond, care for, and breastfeed (if possible and chosen). I think our society should respect mothers and children enough to recognize this is WORK -- and give new moms (and dads) a little paid time off. As a society, do we really care about creating healthy families...or is that just lip service?
Abigail
9:29 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Why do you feel it's an employer's responsibility to freely give a female employee PAID time off for having a baby? Was that employer consulted when the woman decided to have that baby? No. Is that employer going to be consulted regarding the upbringing of that child? No.
To give birth to a child is the decision of the woman and (possibly) her partner; therefore, she should bear the brunt of the expense and responsibility for the care of the child. In no way, shape or form should an employer be 'required' to provide for the child.
Abigail
9:21 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Jac, not I or anyone else should be held responsible for another person's decision. As for seeing your point of view--yes, I can see that you think all of us should give in to the whims of others, but it won't happen. Each person needs to accept responsibility for their own actions and not expect others to pay or support them.
LG
9:48 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
So, Abigail, following your logic, employees shouldn't be held responsible for any of their employees' decisions.
Therefore:
Employers shouldn't have to give employees sick pay -- because the employees may have chosen to neglect to take care of their health.
Employees shouldn't pay vacation time to people who "choose" to take a vacation.
Why should employees pay disability compensation to someone who chose to get out of bed that day and wasn't omniscient enough to avoid a falling object?
Why should family leave be offerd to anyone with a sick family member -- he or she should "Bear the brunt of the expense and responsibility." If an employee's elderly parent is ill and going to kick the bucket -- it's not the employer's problem.
This is the extension of your logic.
Abigail
10:20 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
So, LG, with your logic you feel that the government or our employers should pay for all our needs. If an employee decides he/she wants to have 10 kids, well, then their employer should subsidize all of those children. The employee should have 12 weeks of leave at full pay, but not just the mother--the father too! And, if the man or woman work for a small company that cannot provide 12 weeks at full pay, then the U.S. government should pay. My, my this sounds like some of those European countries--you know, the ones that are going bankrupt (like Greece).
Who is going to pay for all of this, LG? Are you willing to earn a lower salary at your job so your employer can afford to pay for all of these extras for their employees? You really don't think any corporation is going to dip into their profits to cover this, do you?
I can see from your statements that you are an Obama supporter--socialism at its finest.
LG
10:37 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Nope, you are caricaturing my position. I'm not a socialist, although I do believe a fair and just society is more than just "every man (and woman) out for him/her self."
I don't think employers should pay for all our needs.
But 12 weeks paid leave sounds like a reasonable, respectful amount for working mothers.
Sweden and Canada, two examples of countries which offer paid family leave, are not "going broke."
Maybe the CEOs with excessive exhorbitant salaries could trim them a bit so that their employees can work and raise children under decent conditions?
And you know what? I WOULD be willing to take a pay cut to work in a company that treated ALL of it employees decently and respectfully, and took seriously balancing work and family life.
Abigail
11:26 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
LG, your concept is ridiculous--asking a CEO to cut his/her salary so their employees can have babies. People should be self-sufficient and be able to take care of their own, not depend on their employers OR the government to provide for them.
Twelve weeks paid leave is unacceptable and, no, I am NOT willing to take a cut in salary so one or more of my co-workers can have 12 weeks of maternity leave. You want to know why--because 9 times out of 10, people like me will be expected to do that person's work while they are gone. And then you think we should all be willing to take a pay cut so the company can pay a 12-week maternity leave??!! That's crazy talk!!
This concept is liberalism run amok.
zen
10:53 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
In our current paradigm, family life has been destroyed. Children are just fed right into the system because WORK has become #1. There is more to life than this and deep down you know this. You are always yearning for something more.
In a better world we would take care of our own. Do you know what it means to be self-sufficient? No, it has nothing to do with running a company or having a vault of paper 'ioweu' fiat money. Some rich people don't even know how to drive a car or other basic skills that we take for granted.
So, the short answer is the system can't be fixed. It needs a re-boot.
Teach the (wo)man to fish [live a self-and community-sufficient lifestyle], don't just give her/him a fish.
grandpa
8:30 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
Zen shhhhh, you're panicking the sheep. Give a man a fish he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish and he spends the rest of his life in a boat drinking beer.
zen
10:58 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
Abigail, you keep mentioning other countries going bankrupt...have you seen the U.S. balance sheets?
We are all sinking. Better to have tried to keep your citizens afloat than the Banksters who started the mess.
Bringin' Down Briarwood
11:19 pm on Sunday, July 22, 2012
I've seen three or four articles (outside this one) on this general topic in the last few days.
What I've personally found interesting is that ALL of these articles evolved into, "Yes you have the paid leave benefit, but are confident enough to take all of it?" Then every article included a couple paragraphs about how employees are nervous to take take their full vacation benefit also. THAT'S THE REAL STORY AND ALL OF US KNOW IT'S OUT THERE!!
Forget supporting moms or families. Corporations have built a culture where all of us are hesitant to take all the benefits supposedly given to us ... and that includes leave for new mothers.
Karen T
12:03 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
The government will only help you kill babies, not work to provide a good life for them....
Procrustes' Foil
6:08 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
There is an underlying belief facing women, children and families in the US: Women and children in the US are not valued. Just look at all the crimes that are committed against women and children. Just look at the Penn State scandal. Again and again, women and children are "thrown under the bus" and expected to fend for themselves OR worse, blamed and dismissed for barbaric behavior committed against them. Is it no wonder that families in the US are deteriorating?
Laura Gottardi-Littell
6:27 pm on Monday, July 23, 2012
Hear, hear, Luci.
McCloud
7:51 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
There is an underlying poison forming this divisive way to view the world, and I think it's Obama's fault. We are all people, and to group people by sex, race, gay, straight, Christian non-Christian, union non-union, is pure evil. Honestly there seems to be more and more of this, and it is done to secure votes by pointing fingers.
grandpa
8:34 am on Monday, July 23, 2012
McCloud you are right that there is an underlying poison but I believe you are mistaken in blaming Obama solely. It is the job of politicians of all stripe to find problems, (or create them) and then come up with pseudo-answers that result in less freedom for the people and more power for the politicians. It's not new but the populace has become immune to being outraged and the politicians have become more spohisticated in execution.
Jac Charlier
9:54 pm on Monday, July 23, 2012
In a very practical way, could we say that if we do not provide early support for children/parents (including quality pre-natal care) that we may pay instead down the road in terms of delinquency, arrests, drug use, etc... (a generalization, I know) and at a much higher price? This does not define how I look at this subject but as the issue of who pays has come up in the postings, let's give this one a whirl. Essentially, pay now or pay later. Thoughts?
Laura Gottardi-Littell
11:22 pm on Monday, July 23, 2012
Absolutely, Jac. Pay now or pay later. We can already see that at work.
D'skidoc
6:30 am on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
Let's not forget that the far R will eliminate access to contraception, and womens' preventive care if they can....not profitable, and not ok with the religious right. No bc means no choice about if or when to get pregnant. Much of the rest of the country is back to fighting basic battles like access to womens' health care of any kind, much less care for children so both sexes could be both more productive when working, and more secure in the care of their children and their job. Reproductive choice only happens when one has the resources to make the choice.
RationalTht
9:51 pm on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
No, the far R just does not want to force churches to PAY for something that costs a woman $5/month. If you want to have sex, PAY FOR IT YOURSELF. That is like $0.17/day. If you don't like that, act like a man and buy condoms - you should be doing that anyway if you are not in a committed relationship.
Jac Charlier
6:40 am on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
@Laura - Very true! The research on the value of early childhood nutrition and education is very convincing.
@D'skidoc - Yes, it's still an oddity to me that we debate a woman's access to reproductive health care including decisions about her own body! We do not do the same for a man. Why? Does this fit into our support, or lack of support for working moms? What do you think?
RationalTht
9:52 pm on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
Simple reason about not asking questions about men - we don't force churches to pay for men's birth control. Women are the only ones asking others to pick up their $5/month.
McCloud
8:16 am on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
"No bc means no choice about if or when to get pregnant." No brain means no opinions about anything should be shared with others.
D'skidoc
8:37 am on Tuesday, July 24, 2012
Jac, you are far more eloquent than I but I think its an anachronistic, superstitious, misogynistic, religious, patriarchal, fear mongering mess!!!
McCloud: huh?